As mentioned in the 3-part "No, Dummy, It’s Not Like Catholics Vs. Protestants" episode series of Satansplain, there have been countless pseudo-Satanic groups over the years, quite often with names in the form of "[House of worship] of [evil deity]". I'm sure I talked about the typical sort of person who feels the need to make these pointless things and why. Well, I'd like to share an exchange I had with somebody who messaged me recently.
Message #1
Hi I am founder of the Mosque of Satan and have recently got round to reading your Satanic Bible (after about 10 yrs since first downloading it): in order to compare any of our differences or similarities.
My particular interest was in the language used for the Enochian Keys - since in our Mosque of Satan we have what I have since come to believe may actually be the Atlantean language. Whether it actually is or Not is irrelevant, nonetheless I have gone through step-by-step in my most recent Esoteric-Themed Podcast on YouTube [uploaded in 2022]; exactly how I arrived at each letter or syllable (transposing 2 chakras down via use of chakra vowel-sounds and consonants, in order to reach the feminine inversion [of originally masculine Recitation]).
However No such explanation is given with your Enochian Keys.
Are we really expected to believe that someone heard voices, then jotted down what these revealed ?
(By the way I am recent a subscriber to your 'Satansplain' channel)
Was there enough here to make me roll me eyes? Absolutely. But tried giving a response more along the polite lines.
Bill's Reply #1
Hello Devi,
I've never heard of the YouTube channel "Mosque of Satan", and can't seem to find it or any info on it.
Anyway, there is no authorized electronic version of The Satanic Bible (the foundational text of Satanism), so whatever version you "downloaded" a decade ago is an illegal bootleg. So I don't know if it's an accurate copy or says something the book doesn't actually say. You can read more about that in my essay here: https://churchofsatan.com/free-satanic-bible-is-unsatanic/
As for somebody "hearing voices and jotting things down", well that sounds like what practically any mystic or founder of any theistic religion has done. Satanism is a non-theistic religion, and as a Satanist I know that notions of entities like demons or gods are fictional creations of humans. I believe the same about "Atlanteans", since there is no real evidence of a place called "Atlantis". Regardless, as The Satanic Bible explicitly states in its introduction to the keys, the Keys do trace back to what was published by John Dee and Edward Kelley, which went through translations by different groups over the years. As The Satanic Bible states, what is presented is "an archaic but Satanically correct unvarnishing of the translation employed by the Order of the Golden Dawn in the late Nineteenth Century". So, LaVey took what the Golden Dawn had used then, and offers a more Satanically moving translation that better works within the psychodramatic context of Satanic ritual. Likewise, "The barbaric tonal qualities of this language give it a truly magical effect which cannot be described."
As stated earlier in The Satanic Bible, regarding the esoteric nature of the original Catholic mass in Latin, and how its English translation removed that esoteric quality to it, "It is much simpler to obtain an emotional reaction using words and phrases that cannot be understood than it is with statements which even the simplest mind will question when hearing them in an understandable language." Thus I see no reason why a Satanist would need some sort of letter-by-letter translation of Enochian.
LaVey also points out in the following essay, "I find most annoying the person who demands a word-for-word translation of the Keys, not realizing they are virtually like Pigeon English in their lack of grammatical nuance and literary style. If they were to be translated literally, you may be assured that the chanter would sound most inarticulate!"
https://churchofsatan.com/enochian-pronunciation-guide/
Message #2 and Bill's reply
Here was the reply I got back:
I recall downloading it from the actual Church of Satan website !
But my 'Mosque of Satan' is Not traceable via Google search for some reason, despite that 2022 podcast actually being CALLED 'Mosque of Satan' (since having changed it to 'Nejraïg Of Satan' to avoid people of a low intelligence clicking on it). Here's a direct link to that most recent podcast, by the way:
... a video on my channel, the channel of which would have been accessible via link on [this]; my Facebk profile. (Also having 'Satanic-Themed' playlist among channel sections on my homepage).
But after sending my initial message earlier on, I was reminded of the Roman Catholics having taught the prophet Muhammad [H.A.E] techniques for the invoking of Divine Revelation - and similarly, our friend John Dee (undoubtedly a Freemason or something); possibly having access to similar such techniques.
But I far from doubt in the power of these keys - my particular interest being Key 7 (despite having similar Satanic 'Zikhr' techniques of our own)
At this point, I know I could have taken the harsh road. It's not like Satanism is ecumenical. Alas, I decided to just correct the more obvious mistake. I also figured, "Well, Satanism certainly doesn't have a monopoly on the Enochian Keys. If some mystic likes the Enochian keys for some mystic reasons, so be it." So here was my reply:
The official Church of Satan website has never made The Satanic Bible available for a free download. As I explained in the article, there are very good reasons why we'd never do that. Maybe you got it from fake site claiming to be the COS; those things show up from time to time.
Anyway, glad to hear that you enjoy the Keys. I use the ones from The Satanic Bible, and I do find the Enochian sound very moving.
I thought that maybe this pseudo-Satanist might then be off on their merry way. Nah. The onslaught of passive-aggressive, solipsistic lunacy came next.
Message #3: Oh boy, the "J" accusation
I've put the stupidest part in boldface.
The date I downloaded was August 2015 (with your memo being dated 2014).
But I was Not asking for a word-by-word definition [with the Enochian Keys]; since a translation has already been included, which is sufficient. What I was asking was the truth on how each letter & syllable was arrived at.
And have since learned via further research that the writers of these keys may have been attempting to decipher the then-thought-to be-lost Book of Enoch (which as we know today, can be found preserved in the Ethiopian Orthodox): what seems to be a Judaic take on the Book of Revelations.
Could it therefore be that your organisation is really Judaic and only posing as Satanic for purposes of deception ?
Or are your people merely comfortable operating around Jews (about as comfortable as I would feel operating around Muslims or Rastas): perhaps due to some Judaic ancestry ?
I personally find Jews rather unsettling: Judaism being deemed first of the patriarchal religions which took over from the Goddess Matrilinear in 2600BCE for the purposes of inverting World view at the time, towards the patriarchal.
Jah / Yah also deemed as 'fallen' under Satanism; us also going by the maxim / adage "the fallen always wins" !
Which leads me to the point of a major difference that seems to exist between us: ie. your organisation seeming to portray Satan in the masculine !
(Tho again, this could also be deception).
But the truth is that all religions began in the East and the origin of the word 'Satan' is pre-vedic term for Shakti: having been derived from vowel-sound and consonant of 6th main chakra [the most potently feminine chakra].
Moreover in Islam; when someone has been deemed or labelled 'Satanic': this usually implies that that individual displays traits or attributes which are feminine.
I therefore conclude that in proper Satanism we have sworn allegiance to the Goddess Lucifer Satana जीख्रूङ्गेय् ईएय्खेयेय्शेय् [Most High Most Exalted]; Goddess Of Life And True Creatrix Of The Entire Universe (via the same pledge / initiation given under my Satanic Themed playlist)
And then I get another message when I thought it couldn't get any more ridiculous:
By the way, only Islam can have 'Satan' as fallen - a weak point for the other two main religions (who don't know the name of their own fallen) !
But I tell you that for Christians it is 'Allah' (derived from vowel-sound and consonant of the most powerfully male chakra)
And in your organisation's portrayal of 'Satan' as masculine, perhaps indicating that if Not Jews; then you are perhaps Christians [?]
Where to Begin?
With so much profound ignorance and stupidity here, it's hard to know where to begin replying. Let's break each part down one at a time:
"The date I downloaded was August 2015 (with your memo being dated 2014)."
Of course, the date he illegally downloaded The Satanic Bible and the date of my article doesn’t change the fact that he still illegally downloaded it, never mind the fact he's basing his beliefs on something which Satanism clearly isn't. But, more on that later.
"What I was asking was the truth on how each letter & syllable was arrived at."
I have no idea what sort of process Dee & Kelley may have used to construct the Enochian. As a Satanist, I don't see why I would care. The keys’ occult mystique gives them a certain novelty, which combined with their tonal quality, and their themes varied and vague enough to cover a variety of different ritual themes, simply make them good for the psychodrama of Satanic ritual. I don't have a problem with people who are curious and want to pursue more about their origins, but I don't see it as applicable to Satanism.
And now for the insanely stupid line
"Could it therefore be that your organisation is really Judaic and only posing as Satanic for purposes of deception ?"
This question is more loaded than Mel Gibson at a keg party. It's hard to know where to begin. Granted, retarded antisemites like Devi show up to troll the Church of Satan all the time, though I never saw somebody do it in such an embarrassingly disconnected and passive-aggressive way.
The short answer to the question is, of course, "No". Satanism is Satanism, and not Judaism, which is a fundamentally different religion. One has to be profoundly ignorant to not see this.
For the longer answer, let's try to logically break down the underlying premises and conclusions built into this answer:
- Premise #1: The Book of Enoch is part of the religion of Judaism.
- Premise #2: Dee & Kelley somehow derived their letters and symbols for Enochian and in turn the Enochian Keys from the Book of Enoch.
- Premise #3: Some variant of the Enochian Keys was later used by the Golden Dawn, and some variant on that is used in The Satanic Bible, the main text of the Church of Satan.
- Premise #4: Anybody who’d utilize the Enochian Keys must believe in something about them mystically (the angels, the speaking animals, etc.).
- CONCLUSION #1: Therefore, the Church of Satan’s belief system is based on Judaism.
- Premise #5: It’s better for public relations to be seen as explicitly Satanic instead of being seen as Jewish.
- Premise #6: The Church of Satan has an interest in saying and teaching the precise opposite of what it allegedly secretly believes, and turning away people who express beliefs of what they allegedly secretly believe as an organization. (We could further break this down into other premises, but it's still a necessary part of the argument within Devi's rhetorical question.)
- CONCLUSION #2: Therefore, the Church of Satan secretly embraces Judaism and is only pretending to be Satanists to trick people.
And now let's examine them:
- Premise #1 is itself already quite a stretch. The Book of Enoch is considered non-canonical in Judaism and in conflict with the Torah. There may be some weirder sects of Judaism or Christianity which do accept the book, but they're the exceptions, not the rule.
- Premise #2 is still questionable. Nobody seems to really know how Dee & Kelley arrived at the Enochian “language” and the Keys.
- Premise #3: This one is true; we do have some variant of the Enochian Keys in The Satanic Bible. However...
- Premise #4 is simply incorrect. As already explained, Satanism is a strictly non-theistic religion, and the Enochian Keys are only used in Satanism within the theatrical setting of ritual, which is conducted as psychodrama.
- On top of all this, we also see from The Satanic Bible’s “Infernal Names” and The Satanic Bible’s follow-up book (The Satanic Rituals) that Satanism utilizes mythology from all sorts of sources, hardly just Judeo-Christian. Therefore, Conclusion #1 is a complete non sequitur. Never mind the fact that by Devi's own logic, he's practicing Judaism himself by being an Enochian fan.
- Premise #5 is such a joke that I can't believe it even needs addressing, And yet, we see this one all the time from (and exclusively from) only the most disconnected, rabid antisemites. Obviously, as a Satanist I have no objection to rejecting Judaism itself. As Judaism is a spiritual religion, and we Satanists are anti-spiritual, we do reject Judaism. But it takes a profound amount of ignorance to think that by making up some connection between Satanists and Jews, one has somehow smeared Satanists. Satanism is an explicitly adversarial religion. As the name shows, we’re not looking for mass approval. The Church of Satan does rightfully correct misinformation about Satanism, but we are not some kind of anti-defamation league, as again that would be inapplicable to an explicitly adversarial religion (Satanism).
- And of course, Premise #6 is something which conspiracy theorists always seem too stupid to consider as being false. If my beliefs were “secretly” Jewish mysticism, then I'd see no point in being secretive about that; I would just join some Kabbalah groups one who teaches things like that, which they already do right in the open. Alas, I am a Satanist, so that’s not what I believe. What Satanists believe is what you see explicitly written in The Satanic Bible, and again, that sure isn't Judaism.
- This of course makes Conclusion #2 a complete non sequitur as well.
So to recap:
- The Book of Enoch is an ancient Hebrew writing credited to the character of Enoch from the Old Testament, and as it talks about angels, demons, apocalyptic stuff with a messiah, and other supernatural things, we Satanists (being atheists) reject that. As The Satanic Bible states, Satanism is a religion of the carnal, not the spiritual, and gods are man-made. This stance of ours would still be the same even if the Book of Enoch was considered canonical by Judaism or Christianity, or if Dee & Kelley really somehow got their Enochian language by playing around with the Book of Enoch.
- The re-re-re-translation of the Enochian Keys included in The Satanic Bible are there for psychodramatic purposes only. And of course, the notion that the Church of Satan is secretly “Judaic” and not Satanic is absurd, given that our beliefs are completely antithetical to Judaism (as well as the other spiritual religions of the world), and that publicly calling “The Church of Satan” is quite obviously not a P.R. move to “deceptively” hide something, let alone some other religion we don’t believe in like Judaism, which already gets an overwhelming amount of sympathy in the public in the first place.
And the Rest
"Or are your people merely comfortable operating around Jews (about as comfortable as I would feel operating around Muslims or Rastas): perhaps due to some Judaic ancestry ?"
What does “comfortable operating around” really mean here? Satanism is not an evangelical religion, and most Satanists are fine with keeping their religion private. The fact that a Jew is less likely to fly off the handle upon hearing the word “Satanist” than a Christian might is irrelevant. Satanists go about their day "operating around" non-Satanists all the time.
As for “Judaic ancestry”, this doesn't make any sense either. First, as already shown, one would have to be profoundly ignorant to think that Satanism has theological roots in Judaism. A simple look at the Old Testament and The Satanic Bible show that the two religions (Satanism and Judaism) are fundamentally incompatible. If by “ancestry” Devi means Jewish ethnicity, then the question makes even less sense. An overwhelming number of members of the Church of Satan, just like an overwhelming number of people in the world in general, have no Jewish ethnicity. Ethnicity has nothing to do with whether two religions are compatible anyway.
"I personally find Jews rather unsettling:”
I have to wonder if Devi has ever met any Jews in person. I find that people desperate to link us to Jews have typically not. I also get the impression that Devi is from the UK and seems particularly keen on being friendly with Muslims (even though Islam is just as antithetical to Satanism as Judaism or Christianity is). Maybe the antisemitism is in line with that.
“Judaism being deemed first of the patriarchal religions which took over from the Goddess Matrilinear in 2600BCE for the purposes of inverting World view at the time, towards the patriarchal.”
Judaism was obviously the first of the three Abrahamic religions, but I'm not a feminist and thus don't view the world in terms of “patriarchy”. Even so, some feminists believe the Greek and Roman pagan religions were "patriarchal".
“Which leads me to the point of a major difference that seems to exist between us: ie. your organisation seeming to portray Satan in the masculine !”
This is another stupid line which needs some unpacking. First of all, this sort of solipsism we see with some pseudo-Satanists is off the charts, particularly from people who 1) don't really bother to learn what Satanism actually is, 2) somehow feel the need to create a new "Satanic organization", and 3) then approach us as if they're somehow equal in stature to the Church of Satan and ready for some sort of ecumenical discussion.
The Church of Satan was the first in history to establish an actual codified religion calling itself Satanism. The major difference between Devi and myself is that I am a Satanist, whereas Devi seems some mystic with more than one screw loose. Regardless, "Satan" in the zeitgeist is typically a male character, and we may often metaphorically refer to Satan as such. But to point once again to The Infernal Names (which are in the book that Devi illegally downloaded but never got around to reading until after calling some social media content "The Mosque of Satan") incorporate both masculine and feminine portrayals. Never mind the fact that a naked woman serves as the altar for Satanic group rituals.
“(Tho again, this could also be deception).”
No, it's Devi jumping to erroneous conclusions based on false premises again.
“But the truth is that all religions began in the East”
This is not really true, either. Cultures all over the world ended up developing some kind of religion or another. Religion is not limited to the Abrahamic ones.
“and the origin of the word 'Satan' is pre-vedic term for Shakti:”
This is another false bit of trivia. The word "Satan" comes from Hebrew and means “adversary”. Hebrew is an Afro-Asiatic language whereas Sanskrit is Indo-European. So despite sharing some superficial consonant sounds, there is no evidence that the two words share the same etymological origins.
“Moreover in Islam; when someone has been deemed or labelled 'Satanic': this usually implies that that individual displays traits or attributes which are feminine.”
Yes, Muslims say lots of stupid shit. There have also been lots of lingual relations of “left” to the feminine or “sinister”, and so on. Which is why the next part makes even less sense:
“I therefore conclude that in proper Satanism we have sworn allegiance to the Goddess Lucifer Satana” [...] By the way, only Islam can have 'Satan' as fallen - a weak point for the other two main religions (who don't know the name of their own fallen) !"
So in an effort to get away from the "patriarchal" religion of Judaism, Devi looks to Islam, a religion in which he believes women are associated with Satan, while simultaneously priding himself in getting along with Muslims. And of course calls it all "proper Satanism" when it's not Satanism. Also, the claim that "only Islam" can claim certain views of "Satan" is unfounded and irrelevant. I'm a Satanist, not a Muslim.
"But I tell you that for Christians it is 'Allah' (derived from vowel-sound and consonant of the most powerfully male chakra)"
And here we go again with the woo factor. Just because you examine origins of specific words and trace them back (correctly or incorrectly) to specific genders or old religions, does not mean that people using those words are somehow theologically tied to those alleged origins. The word "Monday" has its origins in "moon day", but that doesn't mean The Bangles song Manic Monday is a pagan moon goddess hymn.
"And in your organisation's portrayal of 'Satan' as masculine, perhaps indicating that if Not Jews; then you are perhaps Christians [?]"
Of course not, as only a complete delusional and clueless retard would believe that. Thanks for playing!
